King Dead Wolf Deer (An Attempt at Organizing TLDR)

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Iskuss1418
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King Dead Wolf Deer (An Attempt at Organizing TLDR)

Post by Iskuss1418 » Sat Oct 21, 2017 7:53 pm

King Dead Wolf Deer
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Last edited by Iskuss1418 on Sun Oct 22, 2017 4:13 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: King Dead Wolf Deer

Post by Iskuss1418 » Sat Oct 21, 2017 8:07 pm

KDWD will live in Malekna Forest viewtopic.php?f=154&t=1057.

King Dead Wolf-Deer, as a Wild Hunt mer-monster and one of the oldest beings on Tamriel, would likely have demigod-tier power on par with the Tribunal.

Roerich felt like KDWD should have a lot of work and thought put into it, instead of just making him insanely overpowered in CS.

Roerich: “I mean, he's older than Yagrum, Vivec, Fyr etc. Almost contemporary with Alessia. He was more than 300 years old when the Battle of Red Mountain occurred. 'Mindless monster boss' won't really cut it.
He's a mindless formless incredibly powerful being, but the circumstances around him should be really well written. Not just making him level 200 in the CS.
He was 2000 years old (if you go with MD timeline) during the War of Righteousness. He's older than the expansion of the Direnni Hegemony, although he probably didn't stay there at that time. At one time, KDWD stalked Lympan March, wherever that is. At the time of TES III, KDWD is about 3,800 years old. A RL equivalent would be having someone around that saw Stonehenge being built.”

Saint Jiub thought about having some sort of cult centred around him, “human sacrifices at the edge of the woods, etc.”

Saint Jiub: The local villages would probably feel a certain fondness for it as well, since it would have devoured a fair share of Imperial and Nordic invaders in its day.
Uneasy, terrifying fondness, mind you - it's been a long time since anyone has looked upon it and lived to tell the tale, and you'd be hard pressed to find a Breton willing to enter the woods for any reason, but in this harsh world, you can't pick your protectors.”
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Re: King Dead Wolf Deer

Post by Iskuss1418 » Sat Oct 21, 2017 9:59 pm

A part of the Witch-Knight (viewtopic.php?f=155&p=10540) questline is needing to learn something from KDWD.

Saint Jiub added that having ambient screams/howls for northern High Rock like the Silt Strider moans in Morrowind could be cool. “Something to cement the sense of dread as you approach its territory.”

Image

Miraclestone: We'll have to figure out why KDWD doesn't mess with the knights of the heart too.”

Saint Jiub: “Is it possible to insta-kill the player via dialogue? Would it make more sense to have the player engage with KDWD via dialogue then? Well, the dialogue window, since his "conversation" would mainly be grunts and screams, but if you pick the right options, he doesn't devour you. Something like "Complement his strength and majesty", which leads to a response like <the King's hackles lower slightly and his growling stops as he regards you.>
I feel like any solution that requires the player to engage in combat with him in-game will just utterly destroy his mystique. Even if that combat is completely one-sided as he rips you apart.”

Infragris argued that “KDWD should be a kind of parallel to the way Vivec is approached in Morrowind: The player should be able to fight and kill him if they want to, but it should not be the obvious thing to do, and not his first role in the world or in gameplay. A figure like KDWD is a powerful hook for quests and stories: you should model the way in which he is implemented according to the story he will be a part of.”

Miraclestone likened it as, “That secret side boss from most RPG’s that is tougher than the real goals.”

Miraclestone found the killing in conversation to be interesting, but not fitting with KDWD. “Death by KDWD should be violent boarding on force of nature. I think that idea could be implemented else were though, it has potential.”

Miraclestone liked the idea of ‘bell-hats’ to sooth KDWD in not killing the knights of the Order of the Heart.
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Re: King Dead Wolf Deer

Post by Iskuss1418 » Sat Oct 21, 2017 10:06 pm

Note: Although the paragraph below uses Miraclestone's words, I only pasted in the parts about KDWD so it's sort of paraphrased.

Miraclestone: There is something about the forest that sedates those within it. And maybe this is also why KDWD has stayed there so long, because on a subconscious level it is calming KDWD and keeping it stationary. KDWD is still mad/crazied enough to kill anything that comes near it but not driven enough to leave its part of the forest and cause destruction in HR.

Saint Jiub created an ambient sound for KDWD territory(Which has been added to our new Google Drive).

Drakevarg thought the Wild Hunt should be some Bloodborne-esque nightmare creature.

Drakevarg: "What the hell is that!?" is a creepier reaction than "Oh shit, it's an X!" Both are favorable responses, but every description of the Wild Hunt indicates it's a very offputting thing, not just an imposing threat.
Something that could be reasonably described as a screaming whirlwind of teeth and claws that was birthed from a cannibalistic orgy.”

Saint Jiub had the idea of a correlation between magicka and radiation, that we could go for a post-apocalyptic mutant vibe, for some homunculi and magical beings.

Conversation about the Wild Hunt:
SpoilerShow
Miraclestone: “Wild Hunt isn't strictly 'wrong' or 'perverse' like corpus IMO it is just not orderly. Bosmers hate it because they think that they were saved from a similar existence by the Green Pact. I meant more in a cosmic sense of 'wrong', like corpus is unnatural, it is the body rejecting a blessing in a grotesque way. While Wild Hunt could be argued as natural for the Bosmer, even if they hate and fear it.”
Drakevarg: “No, not that they hate IT, I mean that it only comes into existence when a large group of Bosmer hate something so fervently that they murderfuckeat each other until a hurricane of malice spills out. The Wild Hunt is quite possibly the most intrinsically malicious thing in the setting. But yeah, on the Wild Hunt. Reason I say it's an unnatural phenomenon is that it would never happen without deliberate intent, and every description of it basically describes it as a murderous abortion of nature.”
Miraclestone: “I think there is a 'stipulation' in the Green Pact that allows for Wild Hunts to happen so Y'ffre clearly didn't consider it perverse enough to not allow.”
Saint Jiub: “The Wild Hunt is a deliberate return to the natural state of the Bosmer. They need to follow the terms of the Green Pact. The Wild Hunt, as I understand it, is brought about by a collective violation of it to end Y'ffre's protection for the ones invoking the Hunt.
They have to live very meticulous lives in order to maintain their merrish forms. The Bosmer have to CHOOSE to follow the Green Pact every day, from the moment they wake up until they lay their head down at night.”
Drakevarg: “The ritual is literally a cannibalistic orgy.”
Saint Jiub: “ In the moons' light, from Scotti's vantage, he could see where the Khajiiti had attached their ropes. With a thunderous boom, an avalanche of boulders poured over the pass. When the dust cleared, he saw that the valley had been sealed. The Wild Hunt had nowhere to turn but on itself.

Scotti turned his head, unable to bear to look at the cannibalistic orgy. The night jungle stood before him, a web of wood. He slung Reglius's satchel over his shoulder, and entered.
The line comes from A Dance In Fire, depicting how that Wild Hunt ended.
He doesn't see the ritual that initiates the hunt himself, the Bosmer go inside a tree and come out monsters. We don't know the particulars of exactly WHAT they do.
The Green Pact forbids the harming of plant matter, however, so it's a pretty safe bet that the ritual somehow involves them deliberately violating that clause.”
Mraclestone: “The line does say cannibalistic orgy but I think it MIGHT refer to what happens during a wild hunt, not what causes the wild hunt.
"The Wild Hunt is a magical trait innate to all Bosmer. It is brought on by a collective ritual performed by many Bosmer, causing them to shapeshift into a horde of feral, supernatural beasts. These monsters stampede, changing their form constantly, slaying and devouring all in their path and eventually, when left with no surviving targets, turn upon themselves in a "cannibalistic orgy""
Drakevarg: “Read a bit on the Green Pact. The phrasing implies it's a Valenwood custom, but not all Bosmer follow it. ...yeah, the Pact is optional.”
Miraclestone: The cannibalistic orgy is like the culling at the end of the hunt, where the beasts have nothing left to kill but eachother. as far as I know every hunt ends with no more than 1 beast left.
The Bosmer who follow the Green Pact claim that Y'ffre used it to bind your natural shapeshifting form to the current elf form they have now. For all we know though this could be false. or maybe you don't need to follow the Pact to gain the benefit of stable form.”
Drakevarg: “Bosmer aren't constantly at risk of warping into Wild Hunt beasts, it only happens when they deliberately use the ritual. More 'civilized' Bosmer freely ignore it. Either way, my original point of "the Wild Hunt would never happen by accident" stands.”
Miraclestone: “when you think about it the Wild Hunt really is just the natural elements of Bosmers put into chaotic murderous overdrive. IDT there ever has been an accident wild hunt. and we sure as hell aren’t going to have one in Valenwood if we ever get there. So I'd say it doesn’t even matter if it could happen by accident because it never has or will from TES3 perspective. But I also agree IDT it should be possible to have an accident one.
Infragris: “I agree that the Wild Hunt represents the Bosmer returned to their original, primeval state - whether that is "natural" is besides the point.”
Miraclestone: “I think we can all agree that KDWD should be chaotic in structure which would go against the more common orderly structures we see in TES.”
Drakevarg: “Corpus and the Wild Hunt should both prompt a gut "this isn't a thing that should be happening" response from the observer.”
Infragris: “That's not the metric I would use for those manifestations. An important aspect of both those things is that they are perfectly alright from the pov of the one subjected to it, and may even be seen as preferable to the normal state of things - consider that Dagoth's chosen see corprus as enlightenment, divinity made flesh. The bizarre look of the thing to the observer is more indicative of the gulf between their respective perspectives, to me. So in other words, they look freakish to observers because the philosophy that animates them is alien to mundane nature.”
Miraclestone: “Wild Hunt is disorderly so I would agree that it should be unsettling to some extent from that, but what is more important when talking about unsettling the observer is its size, strength, age and history. We need some attempt at objective feeling about a style if we want to be able to inform the observer visually, even if it’s a flawed attempt.”
Drakevarg: “In the case of KDWD, I wouldn't get any more "logical" than a visual theme. Being a chaotic mess is literally the aesthetic point of the Wild Hunt.”
KDWD's Timeline if He Moved to Malekna Forest:
"So the official timeline, such as I can make of it, is that the Wild Hunt began in Cyrodiil in 1E 369, killed Borgas and the Alessians, devoured itself except for a handful of very powerful monsters which made their way back to Valenwood for a time (with KDWD making its lair in the Lympan March) At approximately the year E3 230, KDWD was enslaved by Camaron Usurper in his bid for conquering Tamriel. With the Empire distracted, Camaron was able to conquor along the west coast up to the Illiac bay with the help of KDWD. The Baron Othrok of Dwynnen lead his army against Camaron and released KDWD with druid magics, placing the thought in his mind to settle in the small patch of forest at the base of the Wrothgarian mountains known as Malekna Forest."

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