Karthwasten NPCs and Dialouge

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Yeti
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Karthwasten NPCs and Dialouge

Post by Yeti » Tue Feb 17, 2015 1:30 am

I have an update. Pretty significant. Might still have too much unique dialogue, though it's hard to tell given the city's massive size. Feedback welcomed. Unfortunately, the forums won't let me post a pdf or docx file. Is there any way to fix this?

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Post by Luxray » Tue Feb 17, 2015 1:34 am

You can always host it on Google drive or pastebin or something and put a link up
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<Infragris> #hell is meant as a spam and off topic channel. Doing a great job already

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Post by Yeti » Sat Feb 28, 2015 11:28 pm

Finally got around to posting this. Progress and stuff.
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Post by Luxray » Sun Mar 01, 2015 1:31 am

This is nice stuff, Yeti. I'll edit my post if I find any more to criticise :) I have made 2 posts with my comments on the dialog so far. Let me know if you want me to make these changes directly to the document file and save you some effort :)

Karthwasten Generic Topics

Greetings – Standard
Lots of these refer to first meetings -- is there alternate dialog for non-first encounters as per vanilla?

Karthwasten – Local Guard Topic
'timber box' should be 'tinder box'

Latest rumors
first topic: 'shimmering' should be 'simmering'

'Then the Thanes sent the garrison in to ransack the city.' -> I think this doesn't flow well (not a full sentence), could join this bit to the previous one with a semicolon, or rephrase

fourth topic: 'The executioner made sure he was strangled nice and slow. Put on a good show for the crowd, at least.' -> If the speaker likes the fact he was strangled slowly, I feel the 'at least' is superfluous

Someone in particular
'Three thanes rule Karthwasten. Thane Doorf Boar-Bark, who leads the Boar Snout Clan, Thane Rolich Old-Shield, the wealthy merchant and Thane Frovol, the aging campaigner. ' -> The first two have both forename and surname mentioned -- why not Frovol too, for consistency?
Last edited by Luxray on Sun Mar 01, 2015 1:34 am, edited 2 times in total.
<roerich> woah it's hot in here
<Lord Berandas> it must be Summer.
<Infragris> #hell is meant as a spam and off topic channel. Doing a great job already

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Post by Luxray » Sun Mar 01, 2015 1:32 am

Karthwasten Unique Dialogue

Thane Forvol
Karthwasten topic: 'We’ve had a fair share of trouble with those Redguard rebels – I forget what they’re called –' -> Might this be nicer if instead of 'what they're called' he says 'what they call themselves'?

There is a bit of discrepancy between topics if he is called 'Forvol' or 'Frovol'

Prince Alarod
Karthwasten topic: 'Such are the rewards granted to those who serve their liege faithfully.' -> Turn 'liege' into 'lieges' to imply Alarod's royal excellency even further

Leofric
I laughed out loud at this guy's greetings. Really funny!

Karthwasten topic: 'They should be out looping off heads and...' -> 'looping' should be 'lopping'; 'foodstuff' should be 'foodstuffs'

Ties-the-bark
Karthwasten topic: The first few sentences don't flow well, I don't know if this is intentional given he is Argonian, but it could benefit from some extra words or commas

Brilwald
Background topic: 'I am Eumand Brilwald, %Class, %Rank and High Treasurer of Karthwasten. Under the emperor' -> 'emperor' should be 'Emperor'?

Thane Doorf Boar-Bark
Background topic: his name is spelled wrongly (Droorf)

Aldor Word-Belcher
Karthwasten topic: 'Like raging boars, we bled their ranks // Doorf at the front, the Redguard’s sank' -> 'Redguard's' should be 'Redguards' (without the apostrophe). Neat poem btw.

Irolf
Karthwasten topic: 'arms fit' -> missing a period at the end

Jenah
Background topic: ' he bilks them' -> 'bilks' should be 'bills'?

Karthwasten topic: 'If you can avert their eyes' -> Surely this should be 'catch'? 'avert' means they would be looking away from you (not so good if you want to chat with them)

Aladoer
Background topic: 'waste my time by addressing to me' -> 'addressing to' should be 'addressing'

Karthwasten topic: 'Really, the whole city' -> change 'the' to 'this' I would suggest. Also I love this guy

Eranus Jaldo
I think his name is spelled 'Oranus' in the generic dialog topics?
<roerich> woah it's hot in here
<Lord Berandas> it must be Summer.
<Infragris> #hell is meant as a spam and off topic channel. Doing a great job already

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Post by roerich » Sun Mar 01, 2015 11:25 am

Where to begin? This is a really impressive picee of work, to say the least. I have no doubt Karthwasten will prove an excellent city to explore.

Don't forget I wrote some generic dialogue as well: http://www.shotn.com/forums/viewtopic.p ... 27b7d505f1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; if you find any of it salvageable. More rumors is always a good thing. They could of course be altered to fit your vision and excellence.

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Post by Yeti » Sun Mar 01, 2015 2:09 pm

Don't worry. I haven't forgotten about you dialogue, roerich. I'll post something with it soon. 8-)

Thanks for the feedback, Luxray.

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Post by Yeti » Wed Oct 07, 2015 2:55 pm

Here's the newest file. If someone wants to work on the sourrounding landscape, be my guest.
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Post by Yeti » Thu Feb 04, 2016 12:15 pm

Karthwasten dialogue is taking longer than expected. Here's the link to the current Google Doc for those who want to follow along. Don't worry about the lack of entries in the unique section. I'll be filling those in with dialogue adapted from my previous drafts.

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Post by Yeti » Sat Feb 06, 2016 10:29 pm

I'm finally starting to write the Services, Someone in particular, and Specific place topics. I've been putting these on the back-burner for far too long. What I have so far:

Services – Upper Class

The best wares can be found in the shops that surround the Market Plaza. Ancor the enchanter has a good stock of magical scrolls and trinkets. For potions and rare ingredients, visit Rianard Yvirne. With no Mages Guild in town, you’ll need to see Silanya for spells. A rich merchant or traveler can enjoy a restful and luxurious stay at the Ruby Drake inn. At the marketplace, peddlers and common craftsmen sell wares of questionable quality.

Services – Lower Class

All sorts of wares are sold at the marketplace. Jolnor’s tradehouse stocks supplies on the cheap and Iertus Vancor crafts durable weapons and armor. Tivela Norvayn the pawnbroker sells odds and ends at her nearby shop. You can grab grub or a bed at the Drooping Mare, if you don’t mind the sparse lodgings, or at the Curved Sabre, a popular tavern and brothel. If you're sick, Tabica sells potions and herbs for a reasonable price. The Imperia Cult also cures illnesses at its Chapel near the gate. From the stables, carriages take travelers to Dragonstar, Markarth, and North Hall.

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Post by Luxray » Sun Feb 07, 2016 9:50 am

Sounds good. Did you cut some of your dialogue from that Google Doc? I think you had entries for some of the NPCs there, but maybe you weren't happy with it.
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Post by Yeti » Sun Feb 07, 2016 6:45 pm

The NPC entries are still there at the bottom. At least, when I load the document, I can see them.

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Post by roerich » Sun Feb 07, 2016 8:54 pm

Remember I wrote some "latest rumors" and "little advice" on the old forum, if you want to use them.

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Post by worsas » Tue Feb 09, 2016 12:55 pm

Do you still have the generic dialogue in mind that I removed from Skyrim_Data?
viewtopic.php?f=102&t=540" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Maybe we should take close orientation on Infragris' dialogue file for Cyrodiil. He has covered a lot of stuff in there which we would only need to copy and adapt for us. And it would make it easy to work on dialogue and quests for both projects.

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Post by Yeti » Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:11 pm

Ah yes, I remember that topic. I've been trying to compile a list of generic dialogue topics we need. I suppose we could use Infragris's file as a basis for the very basic stuff, sure.

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Post by Luxray » Sun Apr 03, 2016 9:58 pm

Let us know if there are any topics you need us to come up with general responses for Nords, Yeti. :)
<roerich> woah it's hot in here
<Lord Berandas> it must be Summer.
<Infragris> #hell is meant as a spam and off topic channel. Doing a great job already

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Post by Yeti » Tue May 10, 2016 11:45 am

The Google doc linked below contains a draft of almost all Karthwasten's basic dialogue. I only have a few more holes to fill, here and there. Truthfully, I should have finished this months ago, but I've been somewhat distracted lately. As usual, feedback is appreciated.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1kuM ... ef=2&pli=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Post by Luxray » Tue May 10, 2016 4:30 pm

Nicely done so far. I liked the tip about Direnni artifacts, and the Fighters Guild being led by a wastrel knight, made me laugh. I noticed some spelling errors here and there, though I'll pick those up again when you're finished, to save busywork.

It might be good to have the option to ask a scout about the nearby towns -- Dragonstar, for example, is mentioned by someone as where Jarla Jona is right now, but I guess players might not even know where that is. Markarth as well.
But perhaps those factor more into generic dialogue. I can do those, if you wanted.

Is there going to be unique dialogue for the Nord spymaster who lives somewhere about? Not quite sure where he could factor in or what he might have to say.

Also if you want help with the CS-implementation of all this dialogue when it's finished, do shout!
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Post by Yeti » Wed May 11, 2016 5:02 am

Thanks for the support! Scout responses should either be handled as Hold-wide dialogue writing, or it should be written when the dialogue for that location is written (so a Scout response for Dragonstar would be written when we write the dialogue for Dragonstar).

Ah yes, I remember there was supposed to be a Nord spymaster at one point. I removed him because there were too many unique characters in the city. Even now, the number is probably still on the high side. I assume Dragonstar would be a better place for a Nord spymaster character anyway.

Implementing dialogue in the CS is not a task I look forward too, so I might take you up on that offer when the time comes. :)

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Post by roerich » Tue Nov 22, 2016 11:46 am

Should Rolich Gilded-Shield and Dorolf Boar-Bark still be Thanes, or should it just be Frovol now? I don't think it's a bad thing for larger cities to have multiple Thanes. Always only one Jarl, as Jarls rule their own lands, and Thanes serve a Jarl and hold some local jurisdiction as well. Smaller villages like Karthgad being ruled by a Thane in service to the Jarl owning the land, is fine too.

Sometimes the Thane title can work as a mostly formal title bestowed upon someone as part of court intrigues and creating strong bonds between Jarl/King and vassals. This would partly be the situation with Rolich, the merchant and mercenary company entrepreneur. He does have a lot to say economically in local affairs, and he can lend soldiers and gold to the governing powers when needed, so he holds some degree of local political power. The title is also a recognition of loyalty during the War of Bend'r Mahk, where Rolich led some of the important campaigns.

Dorolf of the Boar-Snout clan holds the title for his war efforts as well, where the clan were the first warriors on the wall during the Siege of Karthwasten. The clan owns their manor and a bit of farmland, and helps keep the wilderness near Karthwasten clear of bandits and Reachmen. The court turns a blind eye to the occasional pillaging of innocent peasants. They don't don't hold a lot of power in local politics, and they don't really care either.

Either way, I think Frovol should also hold the title "Steward of Karthwasten", as he rules the city in Jarla's absence. The Jarla situation is quite peculiar, but I think it works well. The Nordic side of Dragonstar is quite small and shouldn't be a Jarldom in itself, especially as there's currently no settlements in the region besides Dragonstar itself and Haimtir. Dragonstar East holds the same status as Karthgad in the political hierarchy, Karthwasten being the hold-throne of the Jarldom. DS should have a few Thanes as well.

Edit: *Fomir the Voiceful instead of Frovol.

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Post by roerich » Tue Nov 22, 2016 12:03 pm

Corrections
Little advice - Lower class

Seems the guards are always looking for a new wretch to string up at the market gallows. One month it's a trader they say smuggled supplies for the Sogat Dur-Gada. Another time it's a Reachman pauper who spied on their patrols. Make sure you don’t get on their bad side.
The gallows have been removed. Could just be "a new wretch to string up".
Someone in particular - Upper class

Most nobles and merchants live inside or close to the Palace District. Thane Formir the Voiceful resides in the Red Palace, along with His Royal Highness, Prince Alrod and his entourage. Thane Dorolf Boar-Bark of the Boar-Snout Clan and Thane Rolic Gilded-Shield live in nearby manors. The once-wealthy merchant Ildos Norvor owns a house next to the Fighters Guild on Merchant Row. Hadnar White-Wind is the captain of the guard and Ranus Jaldo is the priest at the Imperial Cult. Darid is the publican of the Ruby Drake.
The manor descriptions should reflect their new locations.
Services - Lower class

All sorts of wares are sold at the market. Jolnor’s tradehouse stocks supplies on the cheap and Iertus Vancor crafts durable weapons and armor. Tivela Norvayn the pawnbroker sells odds and ends. You can grab grub or a bed at the Drooping Mare, if you don’t mind the sparse lodgings, or at the Dancing Sabre, a popular tavern and brothel. If you're sick, Tabica sells potions and herbs for a reasonable price. The Imperial Cult also cures illnesses at its chapel. From the stables, carriages take travelers to Dragonstar, Markarth, and North Hall.
North Hall should be Beorinhal. North Hall is in Falkreath and will be Nordified/Colovified to Hal Norvold.
Specific place - Upper class

Many grand manors can be found in the eastern corner of town, including the Red Palace and the Hall of the Boar Snout Clan. Merchant Row is the main road that lines up the marketplace with various shops. Should you desire to worship the Nine Divines, the Imperial Cult Chapel can be found by the north gate. Beyond the walls, there’s a dock on the Karth River where ships unload goods.
This should be changed
Specific place - Lower class

Nobles live in the manors of the Palace District and most poor folk live in the Outskirts. Many shops and other buildings are found on Merchant Row, including the Fighters Guild. Make sure to visit the Dancing Saber on the north side of town, and the central marketplace. If you want to know where the Thieves Guild gathers, ask someone else.
Not sure this needs to be changed. It would refer to the south-eastern corner of the city, where, besides the palace, one can find a number of upper class interiors, like the Cassius manor.

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Post by Yeti » Wed Nov 23, 2016 6:48 am

Beorinhal looks too much like Beorichal (our name for Granite Hall), doesn't it?

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Post by roerich » Wed Nov 23, 2016 7:26 am

Lol Yeti. I had the same discussion with worsas a few weeks ago. Apparantly we settled on Beorinhal instead of Beorichal ad the Granite Hall name. North Hall will be renamed Hal Norvold.

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Post by Yeti » Sun Dec 11, 2016 10:24 pm

Just so everybody knows, I'm still working on this. New progress can be followed here.

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Post by roerich » Sun Dec 11, 2016 11:36 pm

Woah, great job on this.
A few notes:
Karthwasten - Reachmen

In our Reachspeech, we call it Mernuin, the Elf Town. A great Redguard konoch once held council here. All tribes knew his power. But careless feasting made his warriors lazy. Fat like wormmouths bloated on carrion. Nords drove them away long ago.
I get that konoch is how the Reachmen would describe a king, but I'd rather see something else used here. Perhaps just "A great lord from the deserts once held council here." or something else.
Little secret - Lower class

Some years ago, Jarl Jona the Ansei-Ender marched her warriors into the Druadach Highlands looking for a fight. Burned down damn near everything in her path, except for Haimtír.
I'd scrap the last part here (except for Haimtir) or perhaps replace it with "and sent tons of refugees into the Druadachs" or something like that.
Services - Lower class

Jolnor’s tradehouse stocks supplies on the cheap and Iertus Vancor crafts durable weapons and armor. Tivela Norvayn the pawnbroker sells odds and ends. The baker Lelena Aurtius lives by the windmills. You can grab grub or a bed at the Droopy Mare, if you don’t mind the sparse lodgings, or at the Dancing Sabre, a popular tavern and brothel. If you're sick, Tabica sells potions and herbs, and Imperial Cult cures illness at its chapel. From the stables, carriages go to Dragonstar, Markarth, and Beorinhal.
The Droopy Mare doesn't offer any beds.
I'd like for the Iertus Vancor description to mention that his wares are of finest Colovian quality.
Someone in particular - Upper class

Thane Fomir resides in the Red Palace, along with His Royal Highness Prince Alrod of The Reach. Thane Dorolf Boar-Bark of the Boar-Snout Clan and Thane Rolic Gilded-Shield live in manors outside the city. The merchant Ildos Norvor owns a house next to the Fighters Guild. Hadnar White-Wind is the captain of the guard and Ranus Jaldo is the priest at the Imperial Cult. Darid is the publican of the Ruby Drake.
Not sure what we agreed upon with the other two thanes. If they should remain thanes or just be influential figures and wealthy war heroes.

Specific place - Upper class

You shouldn’t have trouble finding the Red Palace, though finding your way around inside may be another matter. Most shops are located in the center of town, near the well. That includes the Bazaar, though I wouldn’t recommend its wares. Should you desire to worship the Nine Divines, the Imperial Cult Chapel stands by the north gate. Beyond the walls, there’s a dock on the Karth River, along with the Boar Snout Clan’s Hall. To the east, Rolic Gilded-Shield’s manor overlooks a ravine.
Perhaps change this sentence to "They say you can find anything at the Bazaar, though I wouldn’t recommend its wares."
Background

I am Thane Fomir, brother of Jarl Horir of Beorinhal. As Karthwasten, I govern the city in King Barda’s name, but In the days of the Bend’r-Mahk, I led the warriors who captured this city, fighting to reclaim our lost lands. That’s why King Barda trusted me to instill manly values in his son, Prince Alrod.
Jarl Horir

My brother rules the stronghold of Beorinhal, in the Sundered Hills, as our father did before him. He’s a strong jarl, but also headstrong and ruthless when defending his lands. These traits put him at odds with our king’s better judgement, though only a blowhard would question his loyalty to the throne of Markarth.
I love this, and how it sets up a storyline between the two brothers with very few words.
Prince Oringar

Our younger brother spends his days learning the arts of war from Imperial officers in Falkirstad.
No doubt, he will serve us well in the future.
Finally we have a new for the other prince. Nice.
Background

The name’s Geod Entoriane, %Class and %Rank of the Fighters Guild. I am a knight of the Order of the Double-Edged Torch. Well, I was until “The Miracle of Peace,” when Wayrest took over the fiefdom I served. But why should I be bitter, when I get to enjoy the honor of leading the Karthwasten Fighters Guild. Ha!

Karthwasten

To be honest, I’m not half sure why I settled here in the first place. Things were rather… jumbled after The Miracle of Peace. Rather hard to explain how anyone ended up where they were.
Didn't mention this before, but this is another backstory that I just adore. Really lovely way to make the world and history of Tamriel come alive.
The Droopy Mare

Lorvacah (F)
Reachmen publican. Owns a shabby drinking den.

Greeting

Seek shelter, wanderer? You’ll find beds and food both at The Droopy Mare.
Same as above. No beds in the Droopy Mare right now. I can try to arrange something if you'd prefer for the tavern to have a rentable bed(roll)?

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Post by Yeti » Tue Dec 13, 2016 9:56 pm

I'm willing to say this is ready for review.

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Post by roerich » Wed Dec 14, 2016 8:28 am

Good job Yeti, another great step taken towards the release. 8-)

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Post by Luxray » Thu Dec 15, 2016 11:56 pm

A few typos, nothing that can't be fixed within a wip file. Irja Red-World is labelled as Irja Red-wolf in the dialogue; I prefer Irja Red-World fwiw! Much more Bend'r-mahk veteran. Otherwise very good!! Are you happy to start implementing these NPCs Yeti? Once roerich is done with the city tweaks, of course.

What is the 'FUTURE QUEST HOOK'?? :)
<roerich> woah it's hot in here
<Lord Berandas> it must be Summer.
<Infragris> #hell is meant as a spam and off topic channel. Doing a great job already

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Post by Yeti » Fri Dec 16, 2016 7:52 pm

Sure, I can begin whenever the file is ready.

Those spots are reserved for dialogue that will point players towards quests we haven't designed yet.

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